Stop the ‘Hire and Hope’: Experts’ Opinion—How Systems Turn Virtual Assistants into Self-Managing A-Players with Kirsten Graham, Co-CEO of Six Figure Business Coaching | Ep 250

Dr Steve Day: Warm welcome to Systemize youe Success. I\'m Dr. Steve Day. Now, the interview you\'re about to hear very nearly didn\'t happen. I almost cancelled it on the day simply because I was worried how it was going to go. Kirsten Graham is, in effect, a direct competitor of mine. We both share the same clients, we have a very similar mission.

We help people to systemize their work, create freedom, work with virtual assistants. So we could have ended up in conflict. However, we didn\'t. And opening up this dialogue with another expert who was equally passionate about what we do and how we do it. We were able to compare and contrast our approaches to say what\'s working, what challenges we find, what we find that people benefit from. And in doing so, I believe we actually both grew from the experience of sharing those insights.

I believe this is one of my best interviews. In terms of the value you\'re going to get by listening to two passionate industry experts discuss in depth. And openly about our approaches, both good and bad, about how we help people to create freedom in their businesses. And hopefully you\'ll enjoy listening to it as much as I did recording it.

Hi, Kirsten. Lovely to have you on the show today. I\'m super excited about this conversation. We were just chatting off camera, so to speak, a few minutes ago. And I think we have a lot to talk about. So let\'s kick off. Tell me a little bit about you, what you do, how you help your clients, and why you do what you do.

Kirsten Graham: Sure. Well, first of all, Steve, thank you so much for having me on the show. I love the idea of even though we\'re in the same space. We feel like there\'s a way to collaborate and to truly help people. So thank you for this conversation. I actually started off as a business coach and we ended up one of my clients is now my business partner and we decided to help our clients with marketing and marketing, virtual assistants. And that\'s where our story kind of started. And we have been down this interesting road of outsourcing for many, many years now, and it\'s been amazing and wonderful.

So we really help our clients, clients who want to start a YouTube channel or a podcast. So we really have a very specific process because we provide a trained virtual assistant for our clients. But we also provide all of the SOPs that our clients use to manage the task. Because we really believe you lead people, you manage task, and. And you manage tasks through systems and project management software.

Dr Steve Day: Absolutely. So this is what I was really excited about speaking with you about. And as I mentioned before, we Got on camera. Like when there\'s one of those decisions I\'d made when, when your application came up, it was like, do I want to talk to this person? Like, they could be a complete competitor to me. And like, you know, and I was thinking that\'s the wrong approach, that thinking about this.

I think the right approach is what we\'ve done is to get on a conversation, get on a call and have a conversation about this. Because yeah, we help people, both of us, to work effectively with remote teams. We love the idea of systems. We help people to create those systems, use those systems, SOPs. But actually we probably approach it in very different ways.

I know that your focus is on, as you said, on marketing. My focus is on operations. And so, you know, maybe there\'s a beautiful collaboration somewhere in the middle here. But I think it\'s also, I\'m really excited to understand the process you go through with like four example onboarding clients. Because as you mentioned before, like finding someone, a new member of staff. Wherever they\'re from in the world, like that\'s actually the easy part in my opinion. Like, yes, there\'s a skill behind and it takes time to do, but it\'s the, okay, now I\'ve got this person, like, how do I welcome them into the business. And get them started so they become a highly valuable member of my team as quickly as possible and consistently do work at a standard that I\'m happy with.

I\'ve talked about this on my podcast all the time, but I\'m really interested to hear your approach to this. And see where we align or where you might add some new gems of genius in.

Kirsten Graham: So are you talking about onboarding a new client or onboarding a new virtual assistant?

Dr Steve Day: Virtual assistant. So like bringing, you mentioned before, you help people to find like marketing and marketing based virtual assistants and things and you give them SOPs. But how does that process of actually getting people on board. Maybe what do you see the people doing wrong? The challenges they face and how do you approach that to help them?

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, so when Jeanne and I first created our program. It\'s called the Marketing VA Advantage. Our intention was to help our clients to really leverage YouTube. So whether it was a talking head style channel or a podcast style channel. To help them with their Strategy around using YouTube, talking about the power of repurposing, building their email list with lead magnets. So everything around the marketing strategy.

And we were so excited because in our program we were going to teach our clients how to hire their marketing virtual assistant. And we had everything done for them the job description, the job post, interview questions. We really had put everything together for them. And in my mind, I was so excited. Because I thought everyone needs the skill of learning how to hire, because I love hiring. It\'s one of my favorite things to do. But what happened was we found that when our clients came on, learning YouTube keywords SEO, getting confident on camera, figuring out what they were really going to talk about. That was a lot in and of itself.

So by the time they had recorded their first couple of videos and it was time to move on to the hiring process, we saw them hit a wall. And a couple of people came to us and said, oh my gosh, I just wish you could do this for us. And I think the third person who came in and said that. I looked at Jeannie and said, why don\'t we just hire for them? We can raise the price of the program, but we can do this for them and really jumpstart that process.

So we\'ve literally interviewed thousands of virtual assistants and hired hundreds of virtual assistants over the past six or seven. And what we do is we have a really strong process for what we\'re looking for for a marketing virtual assistant. So our clients are smaller businesses, so they don\'t have a ton of money, so we want to make sure that we keep their production costs down. So a virtual assistant, you know, it\'s like $250 a month for our client.

And they work 20 hours a week. So what we\'re really looking for when we\'re hiring is we\'re looking for people who are passionate about video editing. They love graphic design, but they\'re usually young, but they\'re skilled, but they\'re not like professional video editors or audio editors. So once we interview them. And we find out that they have good basic skills, a good eye, that they\'re really passionate about video editing and marketing, they love that. Then what we do is we bring them.

Our interviewing process is pretty intense. So there\'s a lot of back and forth emails. So we read out everybody who\'s not going to reply in a timely manner, and then they go through an interviewing process with us. Then they actually go into a paid internship with us.

So they have to graduate that paid internship. And there\'s two reasons for that. The first reason is we have standard operating procedures for YouTube production, podcast production, social media production, email marketing, and blogging. And so these are very strong systems that make sure everything gets done. So the virtual assistant is trained on the SOPs. And we want to make sure that they meet deadlines, they have strong communication skills, they are creative and they get things done in a timely manner because we have a very tight timeline as to what we expect.

So once they graduate from our internship, then we\'re ready to place them with a client. We are not an agency, so we\'re not marking up the labor. The virtual assistant literally leaves our paid internship and goes to work directly for the client.

This was what really helped so much, was because the virtual assistants already knew all of the systems that they were using them already. It made it a lot easier for our clients to manage them. Because again, our clients have just figured out what they want their YouTube channel to look like. They\'ve just, you know, they figured out their keywords and their strategy and they\'ve recorded their first few videos. Now they get to walk hand in hand with that virtual assistant to learn the structure. But the virtual assistant already knows it. And that was a game changer for us is making sure that the virtual assistant knew the structure, valued it and appreciated it, and was going to use it with the client.

Dr Steve Day: Absolutely love it. And it is uncanny how similar your approach and your experience of the challenges that your clients face with us as well. And where you\'ve done this by the sounds of it, incredibly well and thoroughly for a very niche part of the business. So for the marketing aspects of it, we did exactly the same thing for systems creation.

And so we slightly different approach on how we do the trading elements. But the fundamentals are the same. And I think that this idea of giving your, your new members of staff, like, why so so often, like especially myself in the other days as well, hiring people in. And just throwing stuff at them and hoping for the best, saying, can you go and do this? Can you go and do this? But without that structure, without that discipline of understanding, this is the way we work in this business, whether it\'s in the marketing or in the operations or system whatever.

And actually the first thing that we get our virtual sense for our own company, but also for our clients go through is similar to you. It\'s a training program. It\'s an internship or apprenticeship fail that we advise people to let people go.

If they can\'t get into it within the first few weeks, then they\'re obviously not passionate about it or it\'s just not the right thing for them. And that I think is like what I see from my own experience doing wrong in the past and what I see some clients do wrong now is holding onto the wrong people in the hope that they\'re going to get better.

And I love this approach that you\'ve got. Which is basically you\'re taking away all that risk because you\'ve put people through this program. They\'ve got to actually qualify through. They\'ve got to actually graduate. So from that program. And then you can actually say, like, stamp of approval. You know, this person can do the thing you\'re asking them to do even before they got there.

And so, you know, we\'ve got very, very similar mindset on this, and I love it. And I think this is where so many people go wrong when hiring and thinking it\'s the person they\'re hiring that\'s the problem. Whereas often it\'s actually they just don\'t have that robust training program in place to give them a chance. And they\'re expecting, you know, they\'re hiring a entry level and they\'re expecting someone to come with 20 years experience of being a marketing genius. And actually they\'re not willing to pay for that. They can\'t afford to pay for that. But that\'s what they\'re expecting. And they want to.

Kirsten Graham: Or they want the magic unicorn. I want a virtual assistant who can do my bookkeeping, be my admin, take care of my marketing. Like, you know, they want somebody who doesn\'t exist. And so it\'s really funny because when we, when we\'re talking with our clients, you know, we\'re very firm. Your virtual assistant will work out if you use the sops. Your virtual assistant will most likely fail if you decide not to use them.

So we still do live coaching calls every week with our clients so that they can come in and ask questions. And we\'re usually talking about their marketing.

But anytime it rolls around to the virtual assistant, nine out of 10 times, they\'ll state their problem, but they\'ll say, I know I\'m not using the system the way I should. So. And what happens though, is we talk to our clients a lot about the fact that when we\'re hiring, we\'re looking for people who want to be with you for a long time. They want to be on your team, they\'re committed to you, they want to really help you grow your business.

But at the same time, you need to step in and ensure that they\'re successful by using the structure that was provided. Because if you don\'t, all that training was for nothing. And so we really have to be really firm with the clients about this is what will make you successful is using the sops.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah. And interestingly so, when I said we took a slightly different approach, one of the approach differences that we took was I used to do similar to you, I fell into recruitment. So I started helping people as a business coach and getting people to create systems in their business so document their existing processes so anyone can follow them. And that\'s really what I originally started doing.

And it just expanded on that over the years, and like you, the brick wall was often faced when it was. When it was a time to go and hire, and so like you, I fell into being a recruiter.

And so we started recruiting and actually expanded it out beyond our client base. And I found a dramatic difference between the success rate of the people that we hired for. That were our clients versus the people that we\'re hiring for who were just general public coming in. And to a certain extent, I quickly switched off that side of the business.

I said, I\'m not going to do recruitment for outsiders because I. I can see the difference. And for us, like the, the. The graduation process for me is actually as much on the business owner as it is on the person that we\'re hiring to train.

So one of the prerequisites for us doing any hiring for anybody. And we do hiring now for some of our private clients still, but there\'s still the same prerequisites in place that.

Have you completed our training on how to delegate effectively, how to record yourself effectively, doing work to delegate out? How do you communicate or manage? Do you understand the principles of good management? How do you onboard a client? These fundamental building blocks of working affectionately somebody that\'s sort of like our graduation program, but we actually look at the client rather than the virtual assistants so much now.

And so, yeah, I just. I think it\'s very, very interesting how we approach it. So cool.

Kirsten Graham: And I do occasionally still hire for my clients. So, for example, I\'ve hired. The reason why we\'re able to supply bookkeeping virtual assistants for our clients now is because I hired bookkeepers for a lot of bookkeeping companies and CPA firms. So I was doing that for people who were not our clients for marketing. And what happened with that was I would always vet the person to make sure they had very clear systems and processes in place before I hired.

I\'ve also hired medical record people for law firms and things like that. But like you, it\'s very far and few in between, because I like to stay like we talked about earlier, stay in my lane. But if I know someone really well, they have their structure in place. And I know their structure, I will, you know, help them with their hiring process, so to speak.

But yeah, it\'s, it\'s 99% of the time the business owner, not the VA, which is hard to say.

Dr Steve Day: You know, it is, it is and I think, but I think if you\'re, if you\'re willing to have that conversation with somebody and they\'re willing to receive it, it can be one of the most life changing things you can do for a business owner is to give them self awareness that maybe it\'s, you know, there\'s some internal workings that need to be also improved to make things work in the future.

So yes, I wish I could go back to my old future self and give myself a bollocking in the early days, but there you go. Cool. So one thing that I am very interested in at the moment is AI and the abilities for this to actually replace huge amounts of the work our staff do to in my eyes allow me to elevate my staff to higher levels of work to be able to add exponentially amount, exponentially more value to my business because they\'re not bogged down in the doing of anything anymore.

And I think this is going to be something that grows and grows and we\'re getting into things like bots now and AI agents and using platforms like NAN for like building complex multi step AI driven operations and stuff. And it\'s all exciting stuff, quite, quite overwhelming in the amount of stuff to actually work through. But the outcome of this I think is in a few years this is just going to come super easy for us anyone to adopt and integrate.

And I\'m interested to know with your line of work about what you\'re doing with regards to virtual assistants, with marketing especially. And I\'d love to get a bit more into the marketing kind of stuff. I think I probably need your help with some of that. And where do you see this new evolution of AI going in the next few years affecting small business owners? The work that our assistants are doing and how are you helping your clients and the staff take on this challenge or grow into the challenge, I should say.

Kirsten Graham: Well, first of all I love your approach that you\'re looking at. It is how is it going to help your team level up? Right. Because there\'s this whole thing about oh well, the virtual assistants will go away, it\'s just going to be AI and maybe in 20 years, 30 years, maybe, I don\'t know. But right now I think business owners need to look at AI as a tool to help their team level up.

So we\'re always adding training into our paid internship with the marketing VAs on how to use different AI tools, whether it\'s video editing or audio editing or creating social media posts, you know, it\'s, there\'s tons of things that they can do to use AI to make them more efficient and we do focus on that.

One of the things that we see a lot is AI is exciting and it\'s fun, but it can also be a rabbit hole for business owners and they can spend way too much time in there not actually doing work that\'s going to generate business.

So for us, if there\'s a new AI tool that comes out, I\'m excited about it. You know, the first thing I want to do is dive into it, but it\'s like, nope, that\'s not on my list of things to do today.

But I can delegate that to a VA and say, hey, when you have an extra hour, dig into this and tell me about this tool. So I think there\'s so many ways that AI is going to help us become more efficient. It\'s going to help our team become more productive.

But again, it\'s one of those things as business owners, if you\'re, if you\'re not good with systems and processes, I think you\'re going to struggle with AI because we need to figure out how to integrate AI into our systems and processes and then eventually, you know, integrate the other, integrate it as it evolves, integrate more of AI and less of the VA, but then figuring out how the VA can manage those AI tools rather than you doing it yourself.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah, 100%. I think it\'s a really sensible approach. And whether it\'s been in the past, you know, going back a few years, really automation, when people really start getting into automation tools zapier and think zapier and things like that made the use of inter applied communication, if you like, totally accessible to everybody.

We had chatbots, things like manychat in Facebook and many hours, hours spent getting into that sort of stuff, which is now completely irrelevant. With AI and each of these stages I have a. Something that we teach our clients and try to educate them about is exactly what you just described is just because it\'s there, just because it\'s exciting doesn\'t mean you need to do it.

And I see like I record podcasts a while ago, which is about why I\'m not getting into AI right now. It was a bit of a tongue in cheek sort of episode, but it was talking about just because it\'s there, just because everyone else is doing it, it doesn\'t mean that it\'s what I need to do today. And understanding about like whatever project is that we\'re taking on, like, is there a business case for this? Like, what will the benefits of it when it\'s finished be for the business in terms of either revenue gained or time saved? And if you can\'t give that business case for it right now, then just pause it or just sack it off altogether.

And I think, you know, that mindset you\'ve got there is exactly the one that I\'ve had from. For the past 10 years. Whatever technology it is, whatever app it is, and this is no different. There will be cases where it becomes so easy to adopt it in that it will be stupid not to. But, like, you know, like for the advent. I know. Trying to think of a really good example, but, um, using.

Using a CRM or something like that, like for sending emails, rather than sending every email individually, you know. That\'s exactly. Yeah. But anyway, sorry, you\'re going to say I interrupted you.

Kirsten Graham: Well, I think AI agents is a great example. So if you have a doctor\'s office where you have a lot of calls coming in, or dental. Dental practice, you\'re a chiropractor. I think AI agents that can answer the phone and reply is fantastic. If you\'re a coach and your phone\'s not ringing off the hook, that\'s not a tool that you need right now.

And it\'s understanding that each AI application is a tool. And the question is, is that tool going to benefit me? The other thing I talk a lot about, especially for writing, you know, AI can be fantastic to help us reply to emails, help us outline our scripts, but I like to say it\'s a hammer. And most people hit the nail with the hammer one time and they\'re done with AI.

No, you need to continue to hit that hammer multiple times until AI creates something fantastic. Because we all know that people are using AI, they\'re whacking out one edition of something and they\'re throwing it out there.

So there\'s so much content that is not relevant, it\'s not solid, it\'s not good, it doesn\'t represent who you are as a business owner. So AI can help you. It\'s a tool. It shouldn\'t do your job for. For you, so to speak. It should be there to assist you when it comes to your writing or your script writing and things like that.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah. I think the experience I\'ve had on getting AI, primarily ChatGPT, we have tried other tools as well to create drafts of content that I am not just okay with sending out, but actually excited about sending out. I think it took about 18 months to get to the point where I was like, oh my God, like, that is as good as I, if not better than I would have written.

It\'s still. Even now, there\'s times I go, nah, it\'s just not right. And so there\'s still got to be this human element coming in. But like that process, like you said, it\'s that tap, tap, tap, tap, tap. It\'s not just a wig wallet with a sledgehammer, it\'s a learning how this thing works, it\'s about adapting it, tweaking it, teaching it. It\'s just like I, I watched a brilliant YouTube video about AI and he was just talking about treating the AI as a member of the team. And what it was talking about was if a member of the team say, you\'ve got a new marketing assistant doing copywriting with you, Brilliant example, a new copywriting system, like they give you a first draft or something.

They\'ve never worked with you before. Maybe they looked to your website and they read your brand voice guidelines, but they\'re still going to need a lot of feedback until they get it just right. And that\'s exactly the way that we approach using AI for any particular task now is you don\'t ever expect it to get it right first time. It\'s this nurturing and educating and training approach which I think is actually working really well for us.

Kirsten Graham: Yeah. And it\'s interesting because you said 18 months and just so people understand, it took him 18 months because your AI is learning you, it\'s learning your voice, it\'s learning the corrections you\'re asking. So over time it starts to understand more of what you want. But that does take time.

I was at a AI training class and they were talking about a tool. I think it\'s notebook AI and it is a closed AI tool. So in other words, it\'s not going out to the Internet. It only reviews what you put into it.

And they took a famous author, they didn\'t say who, they took several eight or nine of his books and they put it in there. They gave it 30 days to study his books and then they asked it to write his next book. He literally said, if I did not know I did not write this, I would have thought I wrote it. It was that good.

But that AI tool was only trained on his work, so it only had to pull from how he developed characters, how he did storylines. So it was able to really write in his voice, so to speak. And I think we\'re going to see a lot more of that closed loop AI Rather than things going out to the Internet, which I think is pretty exciting.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah, no, I love that I\'ve had a little play with NotebookLM, but, but I, I didn\'t, yeah, I hadn\'t appreciated it could take something as far as actually producing a book, which I\'m just about to start doing for the second time is actually to start writing, writing my first book again.

And I\'ve got like many coaches. Like all of my material is recorded, so I\'ve got hundreds of videos and hundreds more podcasts. Like all of my thought ideas are down somewhere in some way shape or form. And so that is one of the things I see AI being a like infinite. Infinite\'s wrong word but a very big help like in, in being able to, for me to like use it to rationalize everything that I\'ve thought about over the decades or decade or so and bring it into something coherent that people can actually understand in a, in a format that is, you know, acceptable in a book.

Because I\'ve limited experience in writing books, but I\'ve got a lot of experience in coaching and so I see it as a way to massively expedite that process to get it, get something hopefully decent out there as well. Yeah, exciting stuff.

Kirsten Graham: I have a little bit off topic question for you, but what do you think? How do you think AI is going to change the medical field?

Dr Steve Day: Good question. I must say. I\'m no longer practicing medic and haven\'t been since the advent of AI but obviously I still think about it and have had conversations with friend medics about this and I think that it\'s already making massive inroads into like diagnosis because just the, the nature that it has access to all the material ever written, all the papers ever written, all the most up to date papers instantly so that, that anything that\'s, that\'s new or old in the industry it can access to be able to actually make some sort of provisional diagnosis and, and it can ask all the questions and never forget them.

I mean being a doctor, a human, we can only remember to ask what we remember to ask. And the way that we interpret something is so based on conditioning that yes, we can get trained to try to think completely objectively, but that\'s just not human nature. And so, you know, you can have the same consultant, see the same patient and have two different opinions and yes, we can do all the diagnosis and hopefully get some sort of actual concrete answer.

But that provisional stage that getting to that point where oh, we need to expedite this, this person needs further investigation it\'s those delays, I think, are often seen as the doctor\'s fault. And I think that if we can act, if we can get that to be much more reliable and consistent with the help of AI, to make it less on the person.

Because you know what, maybe that doctor, maybe they\'re, you know, they just got divorced, maybe they\'re, you know, that their kid just got knocked over, maybe they\'re having a really bad day. Whatever it is, it could be something awful happening in their life and that they\'re there sat in that surgery, trying to take in and process it and give that patient their best.

But we\'re only human. And so I think there\'s so many like that frontline initial, whether it\'s consultants or GPs, whatever that stage. I think that\'s going to happen hopefully quickly. And I think there\'s a huge, huge room for that being a massively positive thing. And I\'m sure there\'s far more beyond that. But, yeah, those are the conversations I\'ve been having on and on people.

Kirsten Graham: I always think about all the studies that have been done curing cancer and how there\'s always fundraisers and people are donating money to cure cancer. I mean, you think if AI could get its hands on, get its hands on, if AI could get a hold of all of the content that have been done, all the studies on cancer, cancer research, there has to be an answer in there.

There has to be a way that we could probably cure cancer. And I do have that hope for AI. I hope at some point that would be the case. But again, as human beings, we can\'t sort through all that data. And people don\'t always collaborate. The universities here are there.

They\'re not always pulling together the data that they\'ve pulled. And so I have high hopes for that in the medical community.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah, I\'m sure researching most areas are going to be, you know, or happy. I mean, AI has been around for quite a long time now. Like, relatively speaking, it\'s only short in some contexts, but actually it\'s been around for quite a few years now. So I\'m sure that\'s happening already in many places.

I tell you, one of our clients actually based on the same sort of, same kind of thing, but he\'s in the medical industry, he\'s an expert witness agency and he helps doctors become expert witnesses. So basically, when someone has an accident, legal claim, then they\'re the one that goes and sifts through the reports and the medical records and basically then gives an opinion which is then taken to the Judge or the insurance company or whatever it is. And so he\'s working with AI to do that work of basically going through the. It could be 10 decades.

10 decades. That\'s 100 years. It could be seven decades, let\'s say, of, like, medical records and actually pulling out every single piece of relevant information, sorting it, putting it into a format, summarizing it like that is hours and hours of painstaking work that he\'s hoping that AI is going to actually transform the way he helps his agents be able to do their work.

And the same thing with the legal industry as well, the massive amounts of stuff they have to go through. So, yeah, I think the possibilities are huge. As you say, slightly off topic, but incredibly interesting.

Kirsten Graham: It\'s very interesting.

Dr Steve Day: Cool. So to get us back on topic, where do you think what as business coaches for small business owners who help people to work with virtual assistants with remote workers. Like, where do you think we get it wrong? What do you think we. Like, how do you think we could do it better?

Kirsten Graham: So I can only speak for myself because I am Jeanne, and I have been, like I said, hiring and outsourcing for a long time. So it\'s old hat to us. Sometimes we forget how challenging it can be for a client. And so we were trying to always think about how do we reverse things.

So, in other words, another example would be we have a program for our clients who want to hire a bookkeeper. And so we go through all of why bookkeeping is important. These are the different softwares you can use. This is how you get everything together for your bookkeeping va.

And when you\'re ready to hire your va, fill out this form and we will pair you with a bookkeeping va. I came to realize I need to reverse that because I can train the bookkeeping VA to hold that client\'s hand to decide on the software or to help them get things together. Because people who are not doing their bookkeeping, they\'re not doing it because they don\'t understand basic math. It\'s one of those things that shuts a lot of business owners down.

You know, all the receipts and the fear of the IRS and all the things. So they just kind of put it off and put it off. You\'re pulling statements. It just.

It just overwhelms them and it makes them feel bad about themselves. And there\'s a lot of shame in it, because I was surprised how many clients say that their CPA talks down to them or their bookkeeper treats them like, you know, they really don\'t matter. It\'s hard to get a meeting with them. So again, evidently I\'m not a quick learner.

Again, created a program that really focused on the client first and then brought in the virtual assistant at the end. And now I\'m rewriting that whole program so that the virtual assistant comes in and I\'m spending more time. I\'m not training a virtual assistant on how to be a bookkeeper. I don\'t know how to be a bookkeeper.

They are people that have degrees in finance or accounting. They\'re quickbook and zero certified. They\'ve got years of experience in small business bookkeeping. What I am training them in is how to support my clients, how to onboard the client, how to figure out quickly who they are as a person.

And I try to do that through the form as well. And you know, for example, we have a couple ladies that are in their 70s and they\'re fantastic at what they do. Their businesses are awesome. They don\'t like technology and they, you know, they just don\'t want to deal with bookkeeping.

So I\'m like, I don\'t care if you just ask them to get one thing each week for you and it might take you a while to get their books up to speed, but go at a speed that doesn\'t overwhelm them and cause them to just stop moving forward. So I would say that\'s the big thing that we forget is that what\'s old hat to us and what we\'re comfortable with is all new to that client.

And they\'re generally hiring someone. So hiring and managing and leading that scary in and of itself. But they\'re generally hiring someone to do something that they don\'t do well, that they don\'t like doing that they find overwhelming or that they have a lot of guilt and shame around.

Dr Steve Day: Brilliantly said. I love that. I think I would.

Kirsten Graham: What would your take on that be?

Dr Steve Day: My take? Yeah. I mean, just listening to you say that has really actually helped me. I\'ll be very honest because I think that I would have said this, I would honestly said the same thing that slightly different way. And what I would have said is that we forget how good we are.

We\'re same sort of thing. We\'re saying we forget how good we are at the thing we\'re doing. And I help people create document systems to delegate effectively, all of that kind of stuff. And people think that that\'s always been my zone of genius.

It\'s just been my coping mechanisms at a very, very early age. As someone who is inherently disorganized and bad Timekeeping, terrible memory. All of the things with a ADHD brain that basically allow me to be the person I am and do all this cool, do all the stuff I love doing. But also there\'s some challenges.

And so since a very early age, way before I knew, I mean, I only figured out that I had a new idea. Virgin brain about four, three years ago now. Three or four years ago. But all my life I\'ve been, I\'ve been coping and dealing and creating strategies.

So I have become an expert, like without even thinking about it. But then I meet people and think, oh, well, you know, I\'ll just, I just, we\'ll just get them, get them going now and that\'ll be great. We\'ll, we\'ll, we\'ll. It\'ll all be good. And you forget that actually the baby steps that people need to go on.

What is the very first thing. So I was going to say the same thing, but from a slightly different approach. And I, but listening to then as well. It was just so interesting to hear you say you basically flicked your course on itself because I did exactly the same thing a few years ago that I had this, this incredible program.

Incredible, I mean, do inverted commas for anyone not watching on the YouTube. Incredible program for, for getting people set up to be the most effective person at delegating to a new remote worker. That it was all. Looks like nothing could go wrong. The problem was the first two modules were just tech, tech, tech, tech, a little bit more tech, some tech.

And it\'s like the amount of people that failed before they got to the, okay, now it\'s time to start hiring. It was just embarrassing. And so it was, luckily for me, a relatively quick realization. But it took me many years to try to get it right and iterations and iterations to try and get it right. And like, how much, like do we need, how many barriers do you need to put in place? Before we give them the thing they actually want and need? And I realized that it\'s very, very few. And if I go back to the first days I had my first assistant, I had nothing. I literally run my business for my emails and I think I had a couple of spreadsheets.

And yet I went and hired a virtual assistant and that was the start of it. And I made every mistake in the book and got it all wrong, and that\'s why I started helping people to do it. Because I realized how easy it is to get wrong, but how easy it is I also get right. And like, that\'s, that\'s the person I\'ve got to remember who I\'m dealing with. I\'m dealing with the me 10 years ago who was sat there just with nothing and just trying to figure out how to literally make that first baby step. And that\'s, that\'s the moment we need to get them and not put the barriers in the way.

It\'s exactly what you said. I think the way you\'re doing it is absolutely brilliant. And you actually, and I\'ve had clients asking me to do the same thing that you\'re doing. And so I may be going away and rethinking my business model in the near future.

But. But this idea of actually providing somebody with that understanding from day one for the clients, that I\'m going to help you in this process. I understand what you\'re about to undertake before you do. And that I think is a really cool way of approaching it.

So, yeah, I like that. That\'s what I sort of taken away a lot from this as well. Listening to you, listening to say that. I think it\'s a really nice approach.

So well done.

Kirsten Graham: Well, I love your business model because again, we stay in our lane with software, bas, bookkeeping, vas and marketing. Bas, we don\'t, we don\'t go out that. And I will have clients who want to hire other people and they don\'t have their systems in place. So I can definitely refer people to you who want different types of VAs. And they need a structure. They need someone to help them create that structure in their business. That\'s just not my expertise. I mean, I think we\'re very good at creating the systems that we have because my business partner and I have very different skills.

So we\'ve been able to bring those to the table and create great structure. But I don\'t think my brain works the way yours does as far as creating SOPs and all of that. But I too, was diagnosed with ADHD much later in life.

Dr Steve Day: So I think many, many of us business owners are. Many of many other business owners have no idea that they are, but they definitely are. And I think it\'s just when you get into conversations, people with people, and you can just see the way their brains work and how distracted they are in the conversations.

And you can see like one of my, one of my clients, I see regularly how much he struggles with just staying focused in the meetings with his staff and how much he just assumes they understand. Because he\'s thought three, three sentences ahead of what he\'s actually talking about. And these, these things that I\'ve had To rein in like in the early days of coaching, like I kid you not. I had a post it note on my. I\'m gonna get a post it. I don\'t know.

I need to show you. You all know what a post it looks like. I had a post it note on my screen that said stop him interrupting. Because I kept. I couldn\'t let my clients finish what they were saying. They would start saying, oh yeah, this is the problem I\'ve got Steve. It\'s. And I\'d be jumping with a.

Even listened to half the sentence. And that\'s the same with my staff as well. And I think so many of those traits we see like, and the systems I\'ve created so much around of it around the work I\'ve done has just been putting down into. Into a practical way how to build an environment around me that allows me to function at my best without me having to worry about. I will sweat the small stuff as they say. So yeah.

Kirsten Graham: Now out of curiosity, are you really solid? It\'s sticking to your structure because I am laginating our great at creating it. And I would say I\'m going, I\'m doing great with all my systems, all my processes on my end. The team does a much better job than I do sometimes. And then I get derailed a little bit. Does that ever happen to you?

Dr Steve Day: Yeah, massively. And I think that if, if I had, if, if it was easy, I would have not created the, the level of detail that I have and spent the insane number of hours on thinking a. How do I improve this, how do I improve my project management? How do I manage the multiple plates I\'m spending at any one time?

Like why does this, why does this require me to spend the next month of my life thinking about how like creating the system for managing the systems. Like, why do I want to spend a month of my life thinking about that? If that was easy and I got it right every time, I wouldn\'t need it. So I would never spend that insane amount of time thinking about it.

But the fact that I fail and the fact that I fall off the wagon, so to speak, again and again and again is the reason I go back and re. Re being reinvigorated to not only apply it, but improve it, make it more usable and less. Remove the barriers from me consistently using it.

And there\'s that sweet spot of when you\'ve worked on something so much. You\'ve taken away all of the noise, all of the extras, all of the stuff that other people tell you you need to find something that actually just works with the right level of detail and complexity and you. And it becomes second nature.

And that\'s the moment I\'ll go, my word. This is what I need my next product to be. This is the next system I\'m teaching people because it is just bang on. And so, yeah, I could not have created anything that I created without being rubbish. Rubbish.

Kirsten Graham: Yeah. And I hope for all the listeners, you realize when we talk about having systems and processes, we know the value and the importance of them, but we\'re human beings. And I always like to use a very simple example, whether I have a coffee chat or a client coaching call. You know, back in the day before AI, I would write all my notes and then I would put off putting them in the system, right.

I would not put them into the CRM. So I would always try to get back on track, you know, 15 minutes, get it done, you know, the whole thing. Then AI comes out. So my notes are written for me.

All I have to do is copy and paste them. And sometimes I will think, oh, I\'ll do it later. It\'s having that system, that structure, that self awareness to say, no, you\'re going to do it right now because this is your process. You\'re going to copy those notes, you\'re going to open up that client file, you\'re going to put them there and then you\'re done with that for the day, you have finished that, or you\'re going to set up a task.

If there\'s a task that needs to be done, you\'re going to set that up. But I think as human beings, you know, and sometimes I think it\'s psychological blocks. I know you did an interview with Curtis recently about psychological blocks. So sometimes we have to figure out when we\'re not using our systems or our process, even if they\'re very simple and basic, what\'s blocking us from doing that.

And so that\'s one of the things I\'m always asking myself is, you know, what\'s. What\'s getting in my way mentally?

Dr Steve Day: Yeah, I love it. And that idea of notes, I\'ve talked about this as well. I use Fathom Notetaker now for that exact purpose. And there are other brands out there, just in case you\'re interested. But I love Fathom for many reasons. I\'ve discussed some of the podcasts and so I. Exactly that. So I have that process where I get my notes and post them in.

And then what I think is, I don\'t like doing this. That\'s my. That\'s one of my triggers is I don\'t like doing this. And now I don\'t like doing it because I didn\'t do it for the past five clients and now I can\'t find the notes and I\'ve got to go back in. And luckily with Fathom, you can just search and find them, like with many of the other apps. But I was like, okay, cool. This is now the driver for me creating the system.

How can I get someone else to do it for me? Is the first step.

Kirsten Graham: Yes. I love that.

Dr Steve Day: What do I need to give them access? So we have this thing called the didact. So it\'s basically one of the things about didact, ao it\'s description inputs that the deliverables, the access, the checks and the time. That\'s how I structure my SOPs. The access, sorry, is okay, what access this person need in order for them to be able to do this work for me.

This is one example. It\'s like, well, I can\'t give them access to my Fathom because it\'s through my Google login. Great. How do I get around that? This is the development for me now. I need to set up an automation to pull the data from Fathom, put it somewhere accessible, and then the staff can do it.

And then I go, right. My staff member, go away. Figure out how you don\'t do that anymore. I want AI or automation to do that for you by the end of the week. And that\'s how we create, you know, a lot of the automations in the business. It\'s like, I don\'t want to do it.

I don\'t really want my staff to do it. So how do we get it done by a system and automation? The system is just the staff doing it for me. Actually, no, I take it one step back. Like you said, the system is me doing it. That\'s System 101.

Like, first things first, document what it is that you need to do. Second thing is how do I delegate to someone else? Third thing is how do I get an automation to do it? And then coming now is how do I get an AI to do something cool with it as well? But yeah, love it.

Kirsten Graham: Same here.

Dr Steve Day: Cool. Perfect. Any questions that you\'d like me to ask that haven\'t already or do you want to ask me any questions?

Kirsten Graham: Well, I would actually like to talk about the other side of the coin for a second and I\'d love to get your opinion on it. You know, one of the things we\'re both passionate about is helping our clients. Right. We want to help them build successful businesses, have less stress, have more time. That\'s all the amazing things that automation, AI and outsourcing can do.

But I think we forget that there\'s another human being on the other side of this coin and that\'s the people that we delegate to the VAs. And what I like to talk to my clients about is when you have someone on your team for a long time, when you have a VA that stays with you, that person really becomes part. They\'re part of your team.

They\'re not just someone you\'re halfway around the world you\'re delegating tasks to from day one. Think of them as part of your team. But they can level up as AI replaces things that they\'re doing. They can level up, but you also have to understand that you\'re providing a job for them and you\'re changing their lives.

I think it\'s so important for us to realize our clients pay their VAs on time. I\'m sure your clients do too. They give them bonuses at the end of the year, they take great care of their virtual assistants.

They understand in the Philippines, for example, they get with typhoons. Here in Florida, we get hit with hurricanes. It\'s the same storm, just called something different. So understanding how to communicate through those things, but understanding that you do have this person whose family depends on you.

And I think that is so important because you know, the VAs are hardworking people and they\'re working hard for you to help you grow your business so that they can take care of their families and live the lives that they want to live. So I think we forget that it\'s really a solid win win there. And that\'s one of our passions is really helping great people work for great bosses.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah, I couldn\'t agree with you more. And this is something that I, for example, I don\'t like the word virtual assistant. I think it\'s a non school word. It means nothing. It doesn\'t have any. Like what is a virtual assistant? What does that mean for me as a business owner now? What are they going to do for me? Whereas if I hire somebody with a role and they can have multiple roles, now we\'ve got somebody who I can actually think, okay, this is what that person\'s doing.

Like you have marketing virtual assistants. I know you just the word. I\'m not saying there\'s anything wrong with using it, but you\'re using it very much in the context of this isn\'t just a virtual assistant. Virtual assistant, like you say, it\'s a person, we\'re just hiring them from a different country. And I think that I try to, with our clients, just see this as a remote worker they hire from elsewhere.

And it doesn\'t matter what role or position they have. They are treated, in my opinion, exactly like you\'ve described as a team member. And that happens from day one. So we have the same set of rules for whether someone\'s a. Or policies. If someone\'s based in the Philippines, if the west, in South Africa, if they\'re in the uk, if I\'m in Sweden, it doesn\'t matter to me.

I still expect people to show up. I expect people to. To be professional. And similarly, I expect to give them their respect and the support and the attention that they need to perform at their best. And one of my biggest values is freedom. It\'s one of the reasons I left medicine, because that took away my freedom.

And one of the things that I\'m hugely passionate about is to help people live with more presence, purpose, and freedom. And so that goes for both me and my staff, and so for my staff to live with freedom, then I need to understand what freedom means to them.

I need to understand that is it that actually they want to work six days a week, you know, 12 hours a day. And, you know, and that\'s. That\'s basically what we\'re throwing at them. They\'re working at nights or whatever. It\'s all of these stories you hear of what people are doing. Oh, yeah, I\'ve got a virtual assistant that\'s doing this for me. You know, every single weekend.

They\'re working whatever they think is a, you know, acceptable. And I don\'t think that is right or wrong as long as the conversation\'s been had and you understand what the value is to the person you\'re working with. And so like you say, I just try to treat people as individuals. I try to treat them as people, as humans, as. As it doesn\'t just somebody working for me in another part of the world.

And I want to understand what. What makes them tick. I want to understand what they value, and I want to ensure that those values align with what I can give them. And if they don\'t, that\'s not the right person for me.

But if it is, then great. And then hopefully we can continue to working together for years to come and then be happy. And like you say, it\'s giving. Often, like when we are working with people from a place like the Philippines, it\'s either like working for us or not having a job.

That\'s often the alternative. It\'s not like, say, if you\'re working in many countries where actually it\'s working for this company or maybe working this company for a little bit less or doing something I don\'t really enjoy, sometimes it\'s either having a job or being unemployed for six months with very little in the way of state benefits or things to support you. And a lot of my staff are the primary sole, sorry, the primary breadwinner for the family.

And so when the family can. It\'s not just their kids, it\'s their parents and often their cousins. And they\'re the person that\'s paying for all of them to go to school. For their school lunches and all the rest of it. And so there\'s a responsibility that comes with that.

And I think that that\'s why, like, going back to like, what you do, like recruitment. Recruitment is so important because as soon as you start realizing all these things that you\'re actually doing, like by giving this on this job, it becomes really hard to take that away from somebody. If I think if you\'re, if you\'re a decent human being. And so if you don\'t get the hiring right, if you get the wrong person in the role and it gets down to a certain point, it can be hard to let go of that person, which is really bad for the business.

But actually for you, morally, it\'s really challenging to do that. So getting that right, getting the right person into your business allows you to be that amazing human you. You can be to support them and for, like, for going forward as well and treat them with, you know, all respect their due and give them, you know, a better life of a result. So in a. Yeah, in a nutshell, I agree with you.

Kirsten Graham: Isn\'t it amazing though? Because our clients, because this is our philosophy, your clients and my clients, they adapt this. We\'re teaching them this right, like, because again, we didn\'t know this when we first started hiring virtual assistants. So a lot of times our clients don\'t know how important it is. They don\'t understand the cultural differences. And so I love the fact that, you know, we\'re on the same page because over the years you hear horror stories, virtual assistants who\'ve been hired and they\'re given zero support or direction, they\'re expected to read minds.

You know, they get cussed out, yelled at, not paid. And so it\'s, it\'s bringing good business owners into, into the fold who want to treat their vas really well. And those VAs want to work really hard for them, and my, my Core value, too, is freedom, and so I love that. That\'s one of the things you talk about. That\'s one of the things we help our clients understand. Build a great relationship with your virtual assistant. They\'re not gonna be your bff, but build a great relationship with them, because the more you guys know each other, the better you\'re gonna work together. And I think that\'s so important.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah, I read a book. I can\'t remember off the top of my head what it\'s called, but it\'s talking about the trust battery. And trust is a great way of building a productive relationship, because the more I trust you, I\'ll let you get on with it. And the more that staff member trusts me. The more they will just have a go and do it without fear of the repercussions.

And that is how we can create something amazing that comes from getting to know the people you\'re working with. They\'re actually taking an interest. And one of the things that we promote is our weekly one to ones, which is an opportunity for them to have time to speak about what they want. I\'m going to say they.

I mean your staff. And that is something that not a lot of companies do as a rule. But by giving that opportunity for them to come with whatever they want to talk about and you just sit there and zip the mouth and listen, that is priceless, because that\'s how you build trust super quickly.

And so that\'s one of the things where I talked before about the prerequisites for us doing any hiring for somebody. It\'s like, do they commit to doing weekly. Weekly one to ones from week one forevermore with this person? And I don\'t care how busy you are, and I don\'t care how many of the staff members you\'ve got. If you want this relationship to work, that\'s the first stepping stone. There\'s other things besides.

But that\'s like, number one, get that right and you\'re on a good way. And so, yeah, totally agree.

Kirsten Graham: Yeah, it\'s. I want to end with this last thing, and I\'m curious to hear your perspective too. One of the things that really surprised me, because I\'ve always had businesses, I\'ve had staff in the US and things like that. I was very surprised with a lot of our clients who would say things to us like, now that I have a marketing virtual assistant, I feel like a real business owner or getting on a coaching call with them and seeing that their confidence just went up exponentially because they have a Team member or things like I had no idea how much I was beating myself up because I couldn\'t get it all done.

And now I have this person. Not only are they doing the tasks that I\'m asking them to do, but we\'re talking about the creative and collaborating. And I was lonely in my business and I didn\'t know that. Have you had those conversations with people? Because that blew my mind initially.

Dr Steve Day: I\'ve had this conversation myself, let alone my clients. But yeah, I mean I very much was that solopreneur for before, before I got into medicine I was a solopreneur for best part of 15 years. And then, and, and then coming from that back into business after medicine I suddenly had this opportunity to work with other people and now I was back on my own again. And so I totally relate to that. All those things you said from a very personal perspective. And that\'s why I got really passionate about helping people to, to overcome that, to actually get that experience of my word.

Now I feel like a business owner because like you say, I\'ve got other people doing stuff for me. When I went on holiday over the summer for Best Part six weeks, I did a couple of client calls in between just to keep people happy.

But pretty much my business sort of from my perspective ground to a halt in the background. However, things just carried on and I came back and I had three sales calls booked in with people that I\'d never met before that were actually through referrals. But my staff had taken those and saw it all out for me. Simple stuff.

But these were three paying who became paying clients. Then when the first week of me coming back on a six week holiday and I was like wow, that\'s awesome. Like and it\'s just, it was not rocket science systems and funnels and like you know, all the stuff that you\'ll help people with. This was just simply having somebody competent to, to take someone\'s introduction.

And we have process systems behind doing this but they nurtured that person through to get them into, booked into a call and that\'s it. And I was like that\'s the moment. I just feel like yeah, I\'m a business owner so that\'s my personal experience and from my clients experience like 100%. Like we\'ve got so many clients, who\'s that? Aha. Moment is when we get them to have their first virtual assistant or first remote worker as I like to call them.

First remote worker. And actually they, for the first time ever they get delegating the stuff they thought only they could do. And I think that what\'s really interesting with this is often those are clients with existing staff.

They\'ve hired people in for different roles, whether it\'s for marketing, whether it\'s for finance. You know, maybe they\'ve got someone helping them with the operations, but they haven\'t got, in effect, sort of executive assistant type role, someone who can just help them. And I think that is sometimes that just that, oh my God, I don\'t have to do it all anymore.

I can actually give this thing to somebody else and they can help me. Like I said, it\'s that moment of just understanding that there\'s more to work than just working harder. That it\'s actually, if we, like for a cliche phrase, we can work smarter. We can delegate, not abdicate. We can delegate responsibility to someone else.

And suddenly we\'ve got more time or more freedom to do whatever we want, whether that\'s high level leadership or go to the park markets.

Kirsten Graham: And I love that. The whole thing about I\'ve been doing it myself or I have to do it myself, Michael, you know, I think for a lot of people it\'s hard to turn that freedom over or turn that responsibility over, but there\'s so much freedom in it. And I often think, I know there\'s virtual assistants that could do 90% of what I do better than I do it right.

They can replace what I do, which is awesome because it allows me to stay in the lane where I am most effective. It allows me to work with the clients. It allows us to create our systems and help our clients. So getting everything off of your plate that is not really important for you to do, I think it\'s amazing. But women in particular, I think, have a harder time letting go.

Dr Steve Day: Yeah. Why do you find, why is the letting go thing, the challenge thing?

Kirsten Graham: So over the years, I think because I joke that men would delegate everything. I like to go to the restroom at 2:00\'. Clock. Could you take care of that for me? They\'ll delegate everything. Where women, I think, kind of hold onto it. And I think it has to do with self worth. You know, our self worth is tied up in how much we can do. And so that\'s been one of our passions.

Jeanne and I work with a lot of women, helping them understand that you deserve to have support in your business and you deserve to be able to. There\'s people out there that can do what you do through your coaching and helping them. They can do it as well, if not better than you do, freeing you up to do what really matters in your business. And I think that\'s. It\'s hard for a lot of women.

Dr Steve Day: I\'d argue on. For different reasons, I think for, for not argue. So that\'s the wrong word. I, I extend that to say, I think that for a lot of men, including myself, I feel very, very. I resonate with that, like from a very early age and maybe quite a feminine person, if you like. And I just, yeah, feel huge. I\'ve talked about this before my podcast, when I coach massively about the, the self worth comes from, like how much I\'m doing. It\'s a badge of honor of just basically working harder and, and that after doing it for so long yourself.

I know with, with, with women it often revolves around the house and with the kids and with the job and juggling everything like. And I think whatever, wherever that comes from, it can still have the same detrimental effects in going forward. And I think so. Yeah, I can, you know, I\'m not trying to relate, I just resonate with it. I think it\'s. Well, maybe relate as well. But. Yeah, nothing wrong with that.

Dr Steve Day: No, not at all. I think, Yeah, I think whatever the reason that learning to let go is one of the hardest but most rewarding lessons we can learn as business owners. And to let go with actual sincerity and not let go, but then keep on peering in just to see what\'s going on.

Kirsten Graham: Right? Yes, exactly. Not micromanage. Well, Steve, I love what you\'re doing and I am so excited that you invited me to have a conversation because, you know, we do work in the same space, so to speak. But I love the fact that I think we\'re going to have some collaborations ahead of us. I definitely want to connect even more and continue a conversation because I love the fact that we have a lot of the same foundational beliefs.

Dr Steve Day: I totally agree, Kirsten. Sorry. Yeah, really looking forward to this. I\'m glad I did this. As I said previously, it\'s like wasn\'t sure before we spoke beforehand how we would approach this. I think this has been a brilliant thing to do. Really excited about collaborating with you in the future and I look forward to it. Before you go, I\'ve got two questions I want to ask you, if you don\'t mind.

Kirsten Graham: Sure.

Dr Steve Day: Quick ones. The title of this podcast is systemize your success. But what does success mean to you?

Kirsten Graham: Success means to me that I get to spend most of my time doing what I love doing that I\'m passionate about. Success for me is also freedom, time and money, freedom, living debt free. And then I think success for me is being able to truly help other people figure out what they value and appreciate and helping them to achieve that.

So I love having those conversations with our clients and figuring out what\'s motivating them, what\'s driving them, and what\'s going to help them move forward.

Dr Steve Day: Fantastic. Actually, that\'s such a good answer. I\'m going to finish with that. Perfect. Thank you very much. Kirsten, it\'s been an absolute pleasure having you on the show. Really, really glad we did this.

Kirsten Graham: Thank you for having me.

Stop the ‘Hire and Hope’: Experts’ Opinion—How Systems Turn Virtual Assistants into Self-Managing A-Players with Kirsten Graham, Co-CEO of Six Figure Business Coaching | Ep 250

But the bigger insight?

KEY TAKEAWAYS: How Business Systems Create Freedom and Flow

BEST MOMENTS: Power Quotes on Leadership and Business Systems

TIMESTAMPED OVERVIEW

Episode Transcript

VALUABLE RESOURCES: Business Systems — Turn VAs into A-Players with Kirsten Graham

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LINKS TO CONNECT WITH THE HOST

ABOUT THE HOST

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Stop the ‘Hire and Hope’: Experts’ Opinion—How Systems Turn Virtual Assistants into Self-Managing A-Players with Kirsten Graham, Co-CEO of Six Figure Business Coaching | Ep 250

But the bigger insight?

​KEY TAKEAWAYS: How Business Systems Create Freedom and Flow

BEST MOMENTS: Power Quotes on Leadership and Business Systems

TIMESTAMPED OVERVIEW

Episode Transcript

VALUABLE RESOURCES: Business Systems — Turn VAs into A-Players with Kirsten Graham

LINKS TO CONNECT WITH THE GUEST

ABOUT THE GUEST

LINKS TO CONNECT WITH THE HOST

ABOUT THE HOST

For more articles related to business systems and leveraging virtual assistants, you may also like:

Other episodes mentioned in the interview:

5 Human-Centric Marketing Strategies with Chantal Cornelius, Founder of Appletree Marketing | Ep 213

SYS 086: How To Avoid Wasting Time And Money On Courses Or Coaching Programs

SYS 134: Hack Your Success: The Personal Systemisation Plan for Effective Task Delegation, Organisation and Automation

How Small Business Owners Leverage The SixR System To Achieve Time Freedom In Under 90 Days

Free On-Demand Masterclass

KEY TAKEAWAYS: How Business Systems Create Freedom and Flow

How Small Business Owners
Leverage The SixR System
To Achieve Time Freedom
In Under 90 Days